More than 1,000 Iraqi soldiers deserting
The U.S. military turned over security responsibilities to Iraqi authorities in the mainly Shiite province of Karbala, Iraqi army soldiers rejoice. (PHOTO CREDIT: AP)
FROM CNN's Jack Cafferty:
Here's something General David Petraeus probably doesn't want to talk about when he delivers his Iraq progress report to Congress next week: More than 1,000 Iraqi soldiers and police refused to fight during the battle against Shiite militias in Basra last week. One senior U.S. military official puts it this way: "They put down their arms, walked away, deserted, whatever you want to call it."
Remember how President Bush said when the Iraqis stand up, the United States can stand down? But what do we do if they just run away? The New York Times reports that the deserters included dozens of officers, including at least two senior field commanders.
Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki responded by quickly funneling 10,000 recruits from local Shiite tribes into the army. That made Sunni tribe members angry because the government has been less eager to recruit them. And of course it turns out U.S. forces were more involved in Basra than originally thought, with 550 U.S. troops backing up the shaky Iraqi operation.
All this comes as the latest National Intelligence Estimate paints a far more positive picture about progress in Iraq. Congressional sources say the NIE suggests the president's "surge" strategy is working. But House Speaker Nancy Pelosi issued a warning to General Petraeus and Ambassador Ryan Crocker not to quote "put a shine on recent events" in Iraq when they testify next week.
Here’s my question to you: What’s the U.S. future in Iraq if more than 1,000 Iraqi soldiers refused to fight in Basra last week?
Interested to know which ones made it on air?
Ralph from New York writes:
Jack, It is plain to see that Iraq wants us to do all the fighting and dying for them. If their troops will not fight for their own country after all the help we give them, the people do not want stability under their own elected leaders. Either we are supported in our fight against the insurgents and terrorists wherever they may be, or our troops should be home and the money spent on this fighting should be used for the needs of our own country.
Sunae from Jacksonville, Fla. writes:
Iraq has no future. We need to pull our troops out and bring them home. Iraq needs to figure out the rest for themselves. If they want a civil war, then let them have at it. We have more important issues here at home to deal with. Iraq has done nothing but cost us trillions of dollars. I never thought in my lifetime that I would see this country be in debt to China. Unreal.
Mark from Kalamazoo, Michigan writes:
We need more of our soldiers over there, Jack. We can't afford to have the Middle East fall one by one into the hands of anti-American extremists. So let's bring back the draft, send over some more troops, support the puppet government that we installed, and . . . Wait, didn't we try this once before in the '60s? Hmmmm.
F. from Las Vegas writes:
We can train their Army, but we cannot insert a backbone where there is no room for one. The same goes for the corrupt government we support there. Where is all the oil money that was supposed to pay for this ill-advised and miserably handled war? We need to get the hell out.
Dave from Ontario writes:
Jack, The only soldiers in Iraq who are fighting for the nation are the U.S. forces. Iraqis love their families and their faith over all else, and are willing to spill blood for those values. Fighting for a democratic nation as a 'higher calling' does not resonate anywhere in the Mideast, perhaps other than Israel.
Michael writes:
All McCain and Bush have to do is give every American a pair of those rose-colored glasses they keep looking through and everything will be just fine in Iraq. Mission accomplished.
@jackcafferty on Twitter
Why on earth should anyone anywhere think that the US future in Iraq is any better now than when Bush started all of this? Bush, Cheney: you can't freaking win!!! Never!!! You lost it the same day you thought it up...
Richmond, VA.
Jack,
It means that these fat cat idiots should suit up and go to Iraq, Afghanistan and everywhere else they want to fight! It means my son, and so many others, who already fought in Bosnia and Bahgdad for 18 months and is on his way back, are being used for "cannon fodder"!
It means the very idiots who keep going down the wrong path don't even care enough about the troops to properly care for them by refusing to sign the new G.I. bill, Bush and McCaine, the POW/Vet! And finally it means they need to be impeached right now!
Jack, What it means is that the U.S. can't fix Iraq only the Iraqi people can. I am tried of us making the scarfice when the people in Iraq won't even stand up for themselves. It is time for the U.S. to come home and let Iraq stand on its 2 feet.
According to John MacCain, the US has 100 years to negotiate the options. Right?
I think we ought to think first before we open in Bagdad , the Bush Library
I think it's looking very dim. How would you feel if some foreign country came here and told you you had to fight against your own countrymen?
Jack, to hear McCain and Bush talk it's going splendid over there, they both must be drinking from the same glass!
Sue-Idaho
Our future in Iraq is bleak. There will be a civil war over there eventualy, so it is time for us to get the heck out of there.
Our future in Iraq is based on November, Jack.
Staying in Iraq does not present a rosy picture for the United States or our troops. If they will not fight for Mr. Bush's idea of freedom, why should our young men and women continue to die for them. Get them out now. One more death is one too many.
Jack, we need to get out of Iraq. I think those soldiers who refused to fight were right. Why shed their blood for the likes of Bush/Cheney, neither of which had any real military service time!
Jack we've gotten ourselves involved in a country and a culture that we do not understand. We were never asked or invited to rescue anybody from Saddam Hussain. The ancient conflicts and old religious hatreds have kept these people at civil war longer than our land has been a country and every time christians have sought to interfere there it has been a mistake. Now we have upset the balance of power there and unfortunately senator McCain is right, we will have to be there for a hundred years to ensure the flow of oil from that region.
the future is not to good for us or the people of iraqi but remember that this is only 1 thousand vs 25 million iraqi people.
I guess it means we won't leave until the next Iraqi president, Muqtada al-Sadr, tells us to.
Jack,
Oh dear.
Brian,
Idaho
Bleak! American soldiers are recognizing that they are in a no-win situation and being led by idiots. I hope that they all desert and tell bush/cheney to send their own daughters to fight their debacle. To many innocent lives have been lost in the name of an ungrateful government.
If they refuse to fight then we should refuse to defend them. They obviously don't want us there anymore so lets get out already.
Oh, my. Imagine soldiers not wanting to fight their brothers!
It means, of course, that we will be there just that much longer. We certainly don't mind killing their brothers.
Hi, Jack
We have no more chance of a future in Iraq than did the British, the Turks before them, the Persians, The Assyrians, Mongols, Greeks, but plenty of Iraqis will have a future in this country and like all the immigrants before them, Vietnamese, Korean, Japanese, Germans, they will undoubtedly contribute greatly to the melting pot.
God bless America with a paper ballot one person one vote democracy.
Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld were the only ones who thought they could see a future to invading Iraq.
The administration has fallen way short of providing for the wounded service men & women; and ordered 'reservists' to make return tours of duty to Iraq.
I am only surprised to know that there ONLY 1,000 soldiers deserting...
If the U.S. so chooses the future in Iraq will be a, long, bloody, expensive, nightmare that never seems to end. If it does can never be worth what we have spentand will never bring OSAMA BIN LADEN to justice. IMPEACH BUSH / CHENEY
If they're never going to "stand up" so we can "stand down," we ought to "bug out."
Jack, when the Iraqi troops won't fight for the future of their own country the U.S. is headed toward making a prophet of John McCain – a hundred more years.
We have pushed theseguy beyond reasonable limits. Mismanagement from Bush on down thru the pentagion. They don't hestiate to say we must see Iraq thru for 100 years but don't have the integrity to ask for sufficient troops whic would require a draft. This applies to McCain in spades.
We need to leave. There is no future. Democracy only works if someone is willing to fight for it. We can only help them if they want to help themselves. Since it does not appear the people of Iraq are willing to do their part, it seems pretty clear to me.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force him to drink. Plain and simple.
Not only that, but we're helping one Shiite group fight another Shiite group, in an area that our closest ally, Britain, has bailed on. And the President keeps telling us we're not in a civil war. He says we're there to fight Al Qaeda, but there's no Al Qaeda in southern Iraq, because the Shiites would kill them. Our President and Vice-President are like Laurel and Hardy, except it's they're not funny. "What another fine mess they"ve gotten us into." It's tragic.
Ed Reed
Port Aransas, TX
I don't blame them. They don't know they are really fighting. They could be killing their own family members & not know it.
Patricia
Palmdale, Ca.
This is the reason we should get out NOW. As long as the Iraqis feel they can depend on US troops to do their heavy lifting the Iraqis have shown they will not stand up, militarily or politically.
It goes to show everyone how things are in Iraq, not just the spin put out by the Polititions and media that have been given the "tour" and report "how well we wre doing". We need the real truth.
Sorry, messed up message. I meant that I don't blame the Iraqi's for deserting. They don't know who they are fighting. For all they know they may be killing family members.
Patricia
Palmdale, Ca.
Just like Obama said, this was a war that we should have never fought. Can you blame these soldiers? I just hope, no matter what the outcome that we treat these guys better then the unfortunate soldiers returning from Vietnam.
Lori
Battle Creek, MI
Unfortunately our future in Iraq is not to be determined by the Iraqi people, Jack. The answer is more dependent on the next US president.
Which begs the question, "Whose country is it, anyway?"
Jack
Sounds like Vietnam all over again, it seems we havent learned our lesson yet. What are we doing there if their own people wont fight for their country ? We have lost 4,000 American lives, lets get out of there as soon as possible.
Freedom to Iraqi's is the right to worship and to be left alone with their faith and their families. Freedom is not a free Iraqi state and the right to vote.
All Iraqis agree to one thing... Spilling blood for family and faith is much holier than spilling it for the democratic nation of Iraq. When Iraqi soldiers are faced with this choice... many will defect..
If the Iraqi government and the U.S. force the Iraqi military to take a stand against the Shiites or Sunni uprisings, they will have to do so with US soldiers leading the way. It is easy to predict this to be the case, with current Bush and McCain plans to be in Iraq for 100 years.
.
First, I don't blame them at all for not wanting to fight in Bush's army. I could have gone to Canada to avoid Viet Nam but chose not too but I wasn't being asked to kill my own country's people. I'm sure that Bush will just say that "This is just another defining moment in the history of Iraq". It means for at least 9 more months we'll send even more troops to sweep to victory or is it "Mission Accomplished". What a terrible travesty in our history.
Actually those 1,000 Iraqi soldiers that laid down their arms were probably the smart ones, and we should applaud, not villainize, them What happened in Basra was one Militia leader fighting another Militia leader...and make no mistake, Maliki is just another Militia leader. Maliki's battle against Sadr just proves how far they are from political reconciliation. If they would all lay down their arms, then we would have real progress. As long as they are willing to fight each other, we go nowhere.
Our future in Iraq will be one of continued losses in a hopeless cause.
Freedom and democracy cannot be given to or forced upon a people using either money or guns. If the people in question do not want or value freedom and democracy enough to endure sacrifices for it, then little can be done. Do not get me wrong. If a people are willing to endure the required sacrifices but the opposition to their desires is simply too powerful, then by all means help can and should be given to them. In our own case, we owe a big debt to France and Spain for 1778-1781. But their aid only came after those in America seeking independence demonstrated a willingness to themselves fight for it.
The desertions in Basra call into question the Iraqis willingness to act on their own behalf. We long ago passed the point where we should be questioning throwing "good money after bad"; the Basra desertions only emphasize the point.
Its says that we need to do a better job screening the Iraqi recuits, after all three square meals a day will get most starving men to lie to your face by telling you what you want to hear.
AS for Iraqi itself I think that it should not continue in its present form, it's creator, Churhill, even said the same thing when he said one of his only regrets was not giving the Kurds there own state.
Maybe we should just redraw the entire map of Middle East
How about this. Lets say you are in the United States Military and you are ordered to go and kill your own family and neighbors and friends. Wouldn't you rebel or desert? Hell I know I would. In this country our own military can not be used against its own civilians. Same thing over there. That is a no brainer. Blood is thicker then any uniform you wear and should be. What would have happened on 9-11 if a U.S. Military jet was ordered to shoot down a commercial jet full of people to prevent it from crashing into a structure some where? Now put yourself in that pilots shoes. Once again it is a no brainer. If you did pull the trigger on that jet you might has well fly out into the ocean and auger your own jet in because you would always be a man without a country from that point on.
We have friends who are doing multiple tours of duty in Iraq. They all need to come home and stop fighting a civil war that's centuries old but acerbated by W's greedy crusade. Let's don't wait for an emergency departure like in Saigon. Bring our troops home safely. For once, let's do something right.
Dear Jack ,
This means our troops need come home . As long as where there . The more they will need us to do their fighting for them . So get the troops home NOW.
Robin J Wagner
Ledyard , CT
Hi Jack,
Like John McCain said–we'll be there for the next 100 years!!
I predict a thousand years of occupation. The Iraqis will never see a need to fix their poblems so so long as there is a Bush to do it for them.The truth is that we have lazy politicians who refuse to access availabe information. We regrettably have leaders here who think that the answer to the worlds problem will be to tranpose the American way of like on the world and then we will live very happily ever after. But reality has shown that those with the mindset of Bush and McCain are wrong. While there intentions are noble, history fails to support them. Iraq is a peculiar environment, with fiercely competing values and deep rooted tribal mistrust. It is a problem that only a resolute effort by the Iraqi's borne out of circumstance or a deliberate will to coexist can ameliorate. Two ways to solve the problem is either to leave American troops in Iraq hoping that the presence Iraqs Perceived common foe will galvanize them into unity or stop using the troops as cannon fodders and have Iraqis recognize that that entity is THEIR COUNTRY.
Considering you have Iraqi's shooting at Iraqi's, this would be expected.
What might surprise you is the number of U.S. military to desert their post, since this war began. Granted, most were from posts in the U.S. or not returning to their posts, but the number would be staggering. A number that is nearly twice that of WWII.
That's the number that you should be thinking about AND the cause.
Harry
Ky.
Perhaps it means that the sets of opponents there, as defined by the US, are not necessarily the opponents that Iraqis perceive, and it is THEIR country, after all! Perhaps the Iraqis do not see and accept OUR imperatives that we have set for them. Perhaps our version of democracy is not in their culture and they are not enamored of it, as cheney promised us they would be.
Perhaps it means that we should get OUT of there, now!!! GWB broke that country, and he can't fix it!!!
The U.S. has never had a future in Iraq and this is just more proof. I am getting sick of screaming I told you so at my local VFW post.
Jack, Maybe our troops should take a cue from the Iraq'i "soldiers", just refuse to fight and this whole mess would be over. Give peace a chance.
Hiram Rapids, Oh.
I think a better question is, if the Iraqi military forces are having a hard time killing their brothers across the way, why is it so easy for us to send our troops there to kill them?
Adam, Miami Florida
Hey Jack,
Sounds like our work is done! neo-cons were so hell bent to bring freedom to Iraq, and now 1000 free soldiers decided this was not their fight. Looks like we can come home now.
Seriuosly Jack,
We do not have a future in Iraq. Even they see that the killing is senseless.
Or as usual there is something we are not being told. There is more to this story then soldiers just won't fight.
We need Al-jazeer English news so we can see for ourselves what the everyday Iraq news is saying about all this.
Why do U.S. Cable Co.'s refuse to carry it?
We are forcing them to fight each other and the Iraqi people are uniting. The deserters made a political statement to the US deserting. Can we give peace and the country of Iraq a chance to resolve their own diplomatic solutions.
Even for someone who was against the Iraq war before it started, this is disheartening.
Who is running Iraq right now? The U.S. military is not. The elected officials are not. I guess al-Sadr is. Maybe we need to do a better job of "buddy-ing" up to him to form a government that can stand up while President Obama facilitates our troops to stand down.
Patricia in Boise
That gives you an idea who we are fighting for and who we are shedding blood for. Do we deserve more of this?
This is another nail in McSame coffin!!! And there are many more to come in the near future.
Jack, who ya gonna call? Those Iraqi troops were scared of their own shadows away from the protection of US and British Forces. Too bad "W" disbanded Saddam's Republican Guard. I believe they could have helped in stabilizing Iraq with the right leadership and US guidance. Mr. Al-Maliki tried to show his strength to America and failed!
It plainly says that if the U.S. does not get out of Iraq now-ALL of our boys will be returning in body bags – if their remains can even be found.
Jack, it is plain to see that Iraq wants us to do all the fighting and dying for them. If their troops will not fight for their own country after all the help we give thern the people do now want stability under their own elected leaders. Either we are supported in our fight against the insurgents and terrorists wherever they may be, or our troops should be home and the money spent on this fighting should be used for the needs of our own country.
I say if the Iraqi's are unwilling to fight and die for their own country, then the U.S. future in Iraq should be clear, we should leave immediately! It does a great disservice to all of our brave men and women in uniform fighting and dieing over there to say that they should continue to fight in a country whose own people won't stand up for it. I'd like to be able to say that any idiot could see that, but I can't since apparently the one running our country doesn't.
Iraq has no future. We need to pull our troops out and bring them home. Iraq needs to figure out the rest for themselves. If they want a civil war then let them have at it. We have more important issues here at home to deal with. Iraq has done nothing but cost us trillions of dollars. I never thought in my lifetime that I would see this Country be in debt to China. Unreal, Bush is such an idiot.
Don't blame them. Why should they be in charge when they have the United States holding their hands all the way. I would bankrupt the U.S just they are doing while we are too stupid to see what is going on. Hell yea. Let's meddle over there for another 100 years. Once we got out of Viet Nam they fought, decided who the leader would be and now after 50,000+ of our soldiers died what are we doing? Trading with them. Go Figure?
It means even the people doing the fighting have started to realize the fight has lost any meaning it might once have had. We're not in Iraq for the sake of stabilizing a nation or rebuilding an economy; we're in Iraq for the sole purpose of being in Iraq.
We need more of our soldiers over there, Jack. We can't afford to have the Middle East fall one by one into the hands of anti-American extermists. So let's bring back the draft, send over some more troops, support the puppet government that we installed, and . . . Wait, didn't we try this once before in the '60s? Hmmmm.
extended
The U.S. future in Iraq has already been decided. Go take a look in John McCain's crystal ball.
The U.S. future in Iraq has already been decided. Go take a look in John McCain's crystal ball. 100 years!
It reminds us that Iraqis are more loyal to their sect than to their central government. it reminds how little we really know or understand about their country and culture. We have already remade their economy to suit our corporate interests, so why not leave the security to Blackwater and bring everybody else home?
The future is better than it was a year ago, when you couldn't have even mounted an offensive by the Iraqi Army. Maybe the question isn't how many refused to fight, but how many did fight. When you are trying to build the confidence of a new army, even fighting to a draw helps. Next time they'll know they can take on the militia and not have their own butts kicked. Half full, not half empty.
All McCain and Bush have to do is give every american a pair of those rose-colored glasses they keep looking through and everything will be just fine in Iraq. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!!
Jack,
To put it in simple context, we need to force the Iraq Government and people to take responsibility and control of thier country. They need to make a decision to either resolve their differences and get on with governing and rebuilding their country to to implode from with in leaving Iran or some other country a clear easy path to expand and take control. It makes no difference how it goes, we need to 100% be out of Iraq with in the next two to three years.
Just another example that more than proves that this war is wrong and that the Bush administration is operating with blinders and ear plugs installed.
Our future is to get out!
Ultimately it has to be the people of Iraq to determine the future of Iraq. If they are unwilling to work at it, there is nothing we can do to help develop a future for them. We are wasting our time, our money and the lives of our troops. We can’t really afford any of these three commodities!
Time for our hard working, self-sacrificing military to come home.
We have the same future in Iraq as we had in Vietnam. It was always a no-win situation. Former presidents finally realized this. The current president is still clueless. Read "the hips" of the Iraqi soldiers and leave them on their own to handle their "new democracy."
YOU BROKE IT; YOU BOUGHT IT!
Are we "turning a corner" here, or "making significant progress" ? I lost track.
Jack, To see the future in Iraq, just look at the present. This time it's 1000 refusing, next time, 10,000 might refuse. Let's stick our heads in the sand and pretend we're making progress and keep surging, while Afghanistan is being taken over by the real enemy.
If the Iraqis had a sincere interest in living in a state of peace, they would do the hard work that needs to be done. Obviously it's not that important to them, else we would have seen results by now. Time for the US to leave and let them figure it out.
1)Since we are loosing BILLIONS of dallars, and the lives of our people over there, why don't we just take all the oil and sell it to China to pay off the money we owe them for this fiasco.
2) IMPEACH THE IDIOTS THAT PUT US THERE!!!!!
3)Get the hell out of there once the debt is paid off
Concrete exit plans need to be made now by the Democratic candidates. How can the present administration 'stay the course' and not take any real action with the current events that are unfolding in Iraq. What did they do in the White House today that has helped our country's situation in Iraq? It is almost like the Bush administration has gone missing as well.
Look, the reality is that it will be Obama / McCain this fall. The Clintons are just ensuring that they will NOT be part of process after teh convention. Fine! We need to move on and clearly define what this election is all about: same old people making money off of military no bid contracts, or the future investment in our kids and country.
Jack,
Anyone from an inner city knows the answer to this, which is why the spoiled rich types like Bush and Cheney don't get it. In the city, if there is a conflict between two gangs, the worst thing the police can do is get involved. If they do get involved, they become the common enemy, and the gangs forget about battling each other.
Now, if we add 100's or 1000's of years of religious hatred and intolerance to the mix, you have the situation we have in Iraq. That situation being that the we are like the police, and we have become the common enemy.
Everyone who understands how these situations works understands that once you get in, you never get out. This is what happens when you have spoiled rich brats in the white house. They're too arrogant to admit they were wrong, and they think us "commoners" don't understand the problem. They're the ones that don't get it.
Jack, i think its time for the brave american soldiers serving in iraq to come home and attend to their loved ones.
the leaders of iraq are busy using their presence to enrich themselves with the blank cheques bush and senate keeps sending them.
iraq will never be stable until all foreign forces leave them to fight for what they truly believe in. the people of iraq are willing to take back their country, but their leaders are weak.
Hopefully we have no future in Iraq.
Boise, Idaho
Ground control to President Bush,
"The bridge is out on the track you are on. If you can't stop the train, at least slow it down to a crawl."
John McCain replies from the Engine car... "My President has already slowed the US train down to a crawl, and we're building a new bridge as we speak"
Hillary Clinton chimes in from the Caboose: "But you Republicans are building the new bridge in Iraq. Remember? I voted for it!"
Barack Obama's voice is heard from the Obama Express: "We're already on a different track, heading in the opposite direction. We can stop and pick up your passengers."
John and Hillary reply in unison:
"Hell no! Pour more coal on the fire, hurry!! We can jump this broken bridge and keep going!"
Like Mc Cain said, we are going to be there for another 100 years! Why should they fight and get killed when they have our troops there to fight their battles? If we lived in another part of the world, the citizens would rise and storm their captial until someone woke up and smelled the coffee.
The U.S. future in Iraq is
I for Irresponsible,
R for Ridiculous,
A for Anti-Productive, and
Q for Quite Disgusting.
So THE U.S. should get out NOW!
Divide and Conquer. It's the Bush strategy all over again. He divided our nation with his infamous ("your're either with us or you're against us") statement accusing anyone opposed to perpetual war as unpatriotic and siding with the terrorists. While we were embroiled in bitter controversy, we were taken unjustifyably to war.
The same strategy works in Iraq. As long as George can keep the Iraqis killing each other there can be no stable central government that is able to protect the Iraq nation from plunder. It's just part of Operation Iraqi Liberation (OIL). I'm sure you'll find it right there in Cheney's Energy Task Force Notes from 2001.
sounds like Viet Nam revisited; like the ARVN why should Iraqis die for their country when they can get the Americans to do it for them? We did the majority of fighting there. When we quit, they quit. Will it cost another 55,000 American deaths to change the administration's mind?
Jack, it's way past time to get the hell out of there!
I know many americans believe that a cut and run from this mess would be admitting defeat. But more and more people are coming out to say there is no way to win this thing militarily. We have to pull back and let the Iraqi people start to take control of their own country. Shift some of the that military money to rebuilding their infrastructure and help them get back what we have destroyed.
Jack,
Iraqi's cherish thier families and their faith. The idea of fighting for thier nation against Allah is paramount to treason for them.
A Sunni will kill a Shiite in the name of Allah, and a Shiite will do the same.
An Iraqi soldier who chooses to participate in the killing of another Iraqi in the name of democracy, will be destroyed by both Sunni and Shiites.
Thank Allah for the Americans in Iraq to do the nationalist fighting for everyone.
We need to give the Iraqi government a date we are leaving and make it clear, from that point on, they are on their own. It's sink or swim time. We have paid them billion in treasure and thousands in lives lost or destroyed with no progress what so ever on their part. They take two month vacations while our troops get two month tour extensions. We have already lost and it's time to go.
They knew they were being used by al-Maliki to attack his political rival Moqtada al-Sadr mainly to weaken him before the elections later this year that will probably spell the end of the al-Maliki's government. Why attack the man who probably by next year will be leading Iraq either openly or behind the scenes.
So, the remaining Iraqi troops still outnumbered the US Soldiers 20 to 1 in this latest offensive. This is a sure sign that they aren't doing their share...
I see this as a sign that the US will start using less troops and more equipment to back up the Iraqis. To be fair, how could they use their own? The Armed Forces blew most Iraqi equipment away on Day 1...
Take a good look everyone, Iraq is the abyss. We only have two choices left, horrible or apocalyptic. Great job Bush, I'd love to hear how you explain this to the God you supposedly believe in.
So, what's so different? The Iraqi army didn't exactly impress the world in either Gulf War I or Gulf War II. The Danes held off the Nazi's longer in 1940! Why are we surprised that today these soldiers are no better than when they were under the whip of Saddam? Shame on us for expecting otherwise.
I can only answer that with a qualified answer. It depends on who wins the November election, and how many new Democrat senators that we get, If that happens, the war will be over soon, if not, oh lets say, about a 100 years from now we will be in our last throes of our Mission Accomplished.
These Iraqi soldiers are shiites, fighting shiites for the same cause, their independence. The location ,the oil("RIiches to a Few Shieks") reserves, and their very existence is at stake for what? There is absolutely no reason in the world for a brother to kill a brother, without a just cause, which cannot seem to manifest itself, upon these beleaguered souls! You can call it desertion, but I call it "New Found Sanity", bravo for the indigious buskin's!
U.S. has no future in Iraq. We are just running after an illusion of "victory". We messed up that country to a point even they can not unite themselves to save their country from falling apart. So before we talk about U.S. future in Iraq why don't talk about Iraqi's peoples future in Iraq.
Nuwan from Houston, TX
When are we as Americans going to realize that democracy is not for every country? China only has elements of democracy and they are surpassing the US in economic and technological advancement.
The future of Iraq should be determined by Iraqi citizens ultimately, and hopefully backed by those nations in the geographically area. We need to stop breeding more violence in Iraq, and start to pull together nations that will help the people of Iraq build the nation that they want. If they choose a nation of violence, so be it...
Very Good. Get out of Iraq asap. Let shiites, sunnies & kurds settle it for themselves. What else can be any better? Let us regroup & worry about our (US)economy, jobs etc. We build our nation.
California
The future role of the US in Iraq is to throw away more borrowed money and bring back more dead and injured soldiers. George Bush will never admit his terrible mistake of invading Iraq and there's no guarantee that the next president will change the present war strategy. Is it too late to dig Saddam Hussein up, revive him, and beg him to take Iraq back?
We have nearly that many a year who desert or go AWOL. What's the news?
hi jack
Im from Florida where we cant even get voting right but we can tell Bush how we feel about this crap him and Dick got us into,the Iraq army is a joke,they will not fight for their own lives as long as Bush allow our army to keep dieing to protect him and his fathers oil fields.impeack him quick
One of the most frustrating things in life is the need to work with people who just don't get it. The war will be an ugly thing to get out of but despite the opinions of those who have sold their country down the river for a profit. John McCain took the opportunity today to speak at the death site of Dr. King and had the nerve to mention the terrorist threats of Iran and the Middle East. It makes me sick to my stomach to think that a man who had three stated purposes in life a stand against racial injustice, a fight against poverty, and opposition to war, is here being maligned when McCain aligns himself with such a visionary. The hypocrisy of Bush, McCain, and all who are trying to emphasize their alignment with King at the same time distort what his life represented, I am appalled.
The Future is Bright. They Ran because they could. When they don't have us to do the Job for them, They'll stand and Fight. They run because they know they have Americans to fall back on. They'll grow a Backbone when we leave.
Mike, From Staten Island, New York
I say we just need to give them some more memorandums and definate responsibilities that we won't help them out of, maybe threatening to leave is exactly what the Iraqi government needs to scare it into shaping up.
Oh wow. This shows that Bush & Co. didn't put enough pressure on the Iraqi people to fix their problems. We went in and "rescued" them from Saddam Hussein and Al-Qaidea so they are now dependent on us! Our troops are being slaughtered over there and over a thousand Iraqi soldiers left? That's so sad!
It simply means we are fighting for something they, themselves, aren't willing to fight for. It means we should start leaving, and we should start now. Nobody fought the Brittish for us. Despite all the odds against us, we rose up and won our freedom because, damn it, we truly believed in a cause. If they don't believe, and don't want to fight for their freedom, what the hell are we waisting our time and the lives of our young men and women for?
Hey, they are doing just what the Vietnmese did when we pulled out, only they aren't waiting till we pull out. When we go the will all be trying to follow us home rather than being skinned alive. I guess we can all say it was Bush's fault, but I didn't see any of the guys standing up with Cindy Sheehan back when it would make a difference, even Barrack.
There is no future. We should leave NOW! This is nothing more now than a civil war, which we have no place in. Bring our troops home immediately and stop using them for cannon fodder!
I wish we had a law that stated any member of Congress who votes on a future war, must send at least one of their own children( or grandchildren) to fight as well.
That is probably just the ones counted for this week. I bet many thousands have left. This administration, including their pedigreed mouthpiece, Petraeus, tells falsehoods about everything. I don't know what he wants to do after his tour in Iraq, I heard he wanted to head NATO forces. If I were them, I wouldn't have him. I think he is more madeup, than fact – just like his Iraq facts and figures.
The U.S. future is we might as well get out now–things are going to go to "hell in a hand basket" unless we stay there for eternity. Thanks, George W., thanks a lot!
What do we do if they run away? We should run away too...
Bush has not told the truth in most situations. After he's out of office, a real evaluation of Iraq can be made. I think there's going to be a lot of surprises. Most likely, the Iraqi government is crooked and there will be no solution with them. The Iraqi solidiers are not fit to handle anything. Our investment money is being stashed by the corrupt government, who may end up in Argentina somewhere, after they're ousted from office. There's still gonna be hard feelings between all the factions in Iraq itself. So, my advice, get out and let them do whatever they're gonna do to each other. But don't spend any more of my tax dollars on this stupid war....
Why help people who don't want to help themselves? You can lead a horse to water....... The US needs to find another energy source and let the middle East continue to destroy itself.
Why are we asking Iraqis to fire on Iraqis at US command and then be surprised at their refusal? It is just more proof that we don't understand their idology nor their tribal ties to each other, we need to get out of there and let them settle their country – I think those 1,000 soldiers laying down their arms speaks volumes and we better be listening. Would you be negative about US soldiers if they refused to fire on US citizens because our Government ordered them to when the soldiers knew they might be killing their own family or friends?
What future in Iraq. We should have never been there, and should be making plans to get out asap. I want to know why this government is being allowed to take all of us down with this one wretchedly insane decision. Where's the one who's supposed to stand up and say enough is enough. Is there no one who realizes that our only option is to "turn tail and run," and that that's not always a bad thing?
Jack, the Bush war in Iraq that both Hillary and McCain supported and voted for is a national and world disaster. All of us support our troops, let me make that clear. However, this is the wrong war, at the wrong time and for the wrong reasons. It was a war prefabricated on lies by the Bush administration.
The war has been a disaster from the get go. The international force is a joke, not in what they have done, but in the numbers of troops from coalition forces. Almost five years ago Bush declared "Mission accomplished." Over 4000 US troops have been killed and almost 30,000 wounded. Ironically, 3874 US troops have been killed since Bush pronounced "Mission Accomplished."
The US assistance for training Iraqi troops and assisting the Iraqi government are dismal failures.
Saying all of this, the answer is electing Obama President and his ending the Bush's war that was supported by McCain and Hillary.
jack, what can i say? do these politicians really care? if it was left to me, i did carry all of washington to iraq, let them do the fighting and lets see how long they are eager to stay there.
Didn't they do that when we went in during Desert Storm? Maybe they just don't really want to fight. But if they can't stand up for their own country, do we have to do it for them the rest of the country's existence? Not!
Jack, it doesn't take a politician or a news commentator to see that The Iraqi army folded in response to Desert Storm, They folded in front of Iraqi Freedom....... They will continue to fold.... talk tough, make some guerilla moves and then fade away.
I believe this is one reason why if we simply pulled out tomorrow, there would be a short.. covol war, not many would be killed and then they would figure out how to make it work...... no one faction is strong enough to take over the other two... Would it be a Bush Democracy? No would it be Iraqi free choice?? Freer than they have ever had in the last 2000 years!!! Lets get out so they can stop killing each other and us!!
Jack, Hopefully, the future is Barack Obama. He will end our illegal military occupation and give the country and the oil underneath it back to the rightful owners – the Iraqi people. The will need to figure out what kind of country they want. Are we as Americans so arrogant that we think that only we can figure out the future of Iraq.
Iranian president Ahmandinejad walked hand-in-hand with Iraqi president al-maliki down a Baghdad thoroughfare without wearing a flak jacket a few weeks ago, after announcing he was coming, and when. By contrast, George W. Bush months earlier snuck into the Iraqi capital like a thief in the night, albeit accompanied by hundreds of armed guards. Al-Maliki himself wasn't told about the arrival till 5 minutes before Bush got there, when aides woke him up and got him out of bed. Yes, this is the man we spent trillions of dollars and 4 thousand soldiers to bring to power. He's that much better than Saddam, and we can't trust him?
Today, Bush is praising al-Maliki for attacking fellow Shiites in Iraq's second largest city, Basra, for "battling extremists, backed by Iran," says he, this being the latest rattle in a right wing echo chamber. But, the insurgency in Basra is standing its ground, despite American airpower ripping up a metropolis, with critics saying the Iraqi army would prevail if it tried. The tally of its indifference includes the equivalent of 2 divisions that have gone AWOL, in 2008.
Thus, "David" teaches Goliath yet another lesson, that being a superpower isn't worth a bucket of spit, except for defending its own borders and bankrupting a country. We, who foot half the world's military bill, are still so insecure we attacked Iraq in a preemptive war, adding cost to a bloated military that puts up further in the hole, in today's competitive, global economy. Moreover why coudn't Hitler proffer Cheney's excuse when he invaded the U.S.S.R. in 1941, initiating the greatest bloodbath ever, that left 30 million dead? "Uncle Joe" Stalin not only inarguably was but indeed proved to be a greater threat to Adolph, than Saddam ever was to us.
Who'd a thunk imperialism would be thwarted by homemade bombs with triggers made out of Tv remotes and cell phones, by "improvised explosive devices." Minus Saddam-style ruthlessness, we can't quell a popular rebellion, superpower be damned. Conversely, any conquering, occupying force here would have to take that into account, that rednecks with deer rifles in Texas and Tennessee could also make deadly IED's.
So, how can al-Maliki and Ahmadinejad, Muslim cousins, in an iconic moment, go kissy face and hold hands, strolling down a Baghdad boulevard in broad daylight? Because Iran's mortal enemy was Saddam, whom we happily eliminated. Meanwhile, for gratitude, a clarion call resonates. According to one poll and 70% of Iraqis, that message is "Yankee, go home!"
Randy, Waverly, TN
It doesn't bode well for American soldiers lives, It illustrates, to me, that (some) Iraqis feel it is better to have a surrogate army fight and die in their place to bolster a government they do not support an It is reflective of an Iraqi Administration that has shown neither the will or the desire to address what, is essentially a 3 sided civil war.
Ergo ther is no futre for the US in Iraq
The Muslim Sects have fought throughout history on the interpretation of the Qu'ran. The only thing they seem to agree on is that Jihad must prevail. Wake up! By definition, we can't win didley-squat. Bush's unconstitutional actions have left up with a very narrow escape route. The USA is truly between Iraq and a hard place.
...once again, our government has proven that it is unskilled when it comes to fighting a modern war and still quite skilled at equipping current and future adversaries. The so-called radical Muslim world has much to rejoice over...the Iraq war will no doubt be written as one of the dumbest strategic blunders ever made by a sitting president. Bottom line, we need a new approach to foreign policy – very soon and with an exit plan that will honor our soldiers, both living and dead, with the greatest honor a nation can bestow upon its finest men and women. Will Senator McCain finally admit his war errors? I suspect not.
Jack
This is further evidence of the futlity of this war. The American taxpayer is being held hostage to protect further exposure of the failures in Bush Administration. Our allies are leaving because there are no weapons of mass destruction or terrorist strong holds. Why don't they find Bin laden? I think he is number one priority!!! This would be a formidable expression of National pride seen around the globe
It means we have no future there and it is time to start withdrawing our troops. If they don't want to defend their own country then why should we put our young peoples lives in danger to fight for them. I realize that we can't just pull out overnight but should pull out cautiously and with much planning but we do need to withdraw.
Jack,
I believe we must remember who wants this "imperialist" war ... certainly not the citizens of Iraq. How many of their family members have to be killed before the US gets out of their lives? We need to take care of matters at home and not be concerned with the rest of the world. Call it isolationism or not, I don't care, because it is time we took care of our problems.
At some point the Iraqi's have to get their act together and be responsible for their own country. We can't hold their hands forever, not when they are pulling us down into recession. The US should not have a future in Iraq and they shouldn't have had a past in Iraq. When will we learn that being a world power entails taking care of our own first and foremost? It's sad that we fight for Iraqi freedom but we have starving children in our own country.
Jessica
Lexington, KY
Future? If McCain is elected, it will be more caualties, followed by bloodshed. If their own Army isn't willing to fight for their country, why are we?
It's been time to go for 4 years, and the Iraqis are proving how much of what we've done has gone to waste. Stop the bleeding, both real, fiscal, and psychological; let's tell the Iraqis to work it out on their own.
There is no hope for Iraq. We should pack up and leave now before another one of our soldiers is killed or injured. It won't matter if we go now, a year from now, or even five, ten, or a hundred years from now. This is a tribal civil war with religious overtones. Who cares if Iran takes over in our place? Maybe they will have the same results we have had. After all, they seem to have the same type of moron running their country as we do.
it means they really don't want,what we're trying to ram down their throats.they want freedom!let's get out,and let them have it!this "war",in iraq,was over within weeks of it's beginning.they lost!let them figure out how to fix it.
Where is the Democrat's leadership on Iraq? Still cowering to Bush, they were elected in 2006 to do something constructive about Iraq and they haven't accomplished anything. Supporting our troops is one thing but supporting Iraqi troops that "cut and run" is an entirely different matter. Time to cut off some of the billions of dollars we are giving to the Iraqi government and tell them enough is enough.
A hundred more years!!!!!!!!!!
If Iraq's are not willing to stand up for themselves, after all this time and training what is America to do? First off you need to make a choice come November, either vote for a candidate that is going to end the nonsense, or vote for a candidate who has already said,'we will stay in Iraq for 100 years if that is what it takes . Unfortunatly Not being a citizen I can't cast a vote but, if i could, and it was my tax money that is being burned up, my economy that is headed for ruins, my fellow country men/women that are being killed, I know who I would vote for!
I hope for you and your readers sake Jack, you elect the right person...
The rest of the world is counting on it!
Sounds like it's time to "test the waters" on a larger scale.
If the ISF are going to lay down their weapons on a larger scale whenever we finally withdraw our troops then I can only think of two possible options: stay in Iraq until the ISF are ready to defend their own land (who knows if/when that will ever happen), or, withdraw our troops (preferably sooner rather than later).
Obviously we can't stay in Iraq "forever" leaving us with option #2 – withdraw our troops as soon as we're shown that the ISF are going to lay down their weapons.
Test the waters (ISF) on a larger scale, and bring our sons and daugthers home!
Well if left to Bush and if by some remote chance McCain wins- we will be in Iraq forever and all Iraq soldiers will be at home or will have fled to Iran or something. How sad, we are fighting a fight Iraq people will not even fight for THEMSELVES????
What the heck are we doing BUSH/CHENY/McCain, why are we still there and these Generals, they are like puppets – they say whatever Bush wants them to say or they are retired like all the others before them who knew we need to COME HOME NOW.
We cannot help Iraq, we cannot make them want freedom, so come on home you wonderful soldiers who are giving so much for them – they do not deserve you – we need you home with your families, your friends and with your APPRECIATIVE FELLOW AMERICANS.
OBAMA will bring you home – have no doubt of that KEEP THE FAITH
Isn't that their entire Army, Geez
I don't think there is a future for us. My suggestion would be to give them some flowers and candy and leave.
Jack – I think its time we get the heck out of there. Enough of our guys have come home in body bags. I don't blame them at all for standing back. More should do it!!!!
This ain't no Korea. This ain't no Japan. Whatever McCain says, this is more like Vietnam. We gotta get our helicopters ready to evacuate everyone out of there as President Ford had the foresight to do. Even President Reagan got us of Lebanon pronto as soon as he saw how wacked out the situation was there.
I have beem sympathetic to the Iraqis thus far however the truth of the matter is if the Iraqis can not solve their own problems, how can we?
It does not surprise me. Some of our military signed up because they felt it was their patriotic duty, but most are just there because they did not have too many career options so the military was the way to go. Like a lot of people, they fell into a career was not all it seemed to be and it presented a direct conflict with their own morals and beliefs. They just said enough is enough and quit. Who can blame them?
Jack, what a skewed question! If two wrongs don't make a right, then why bring up a third? Seriously, what can you expect from a people that have fought each other and the rest of the world since time began? The 'tribes" can't get along and we are just fooling ourselves that we can make a difference...just like we do in every administration with Palestine and Israel. It is the mindless forgetfulness of the American public that falls for this over and over...we are doing good, we are doing good......
Its a clear sign. Either its an expression of "Send more Help", or "Get the hell out". I'm thinking its the later.
As much as I feel for all our soldiers overseas... I very much wish they would do something like what the Iraqi soldiers did today. Just stand down... walk away... most of them know that the war is wrong and they suffer immense emotional distress from continuing to fight... I wish they would just do the same thing, and just stand down in masses and come home somehow....
The same as John McCain's...Bleak.
Jack, we're stuck in the sand with them. but oh well let's just leave them and run.. we're hated any ways.
jack,the future of the military in iraq is the same as it was in south veitnam, during that war. south vietmanese soldiers wouldn't show up,wouldn't fight,and evenuatily just quit fighting altogether. and we all know what happened next. that answer your question,jack?
I believe most of us know what happened but I wonder what will the Bush administration will come up with next, maybe they were practicing new tactics
Bring the soldiers home, and use the money to take care of them and the ones already here that aren't geting the help they need.
that means the u.s. work is done, bush was right we have brought democracy to iraq. all hail the darth bush
What future??
I think I just heard a giant toilet flush in Iraq
Jack,
If the Iraqi's are not willing to fight for themselves it is useless for us to be there. I wonder what the real' agreement' with Iran entailed?
Send our Troops home!
Deidre, West Palm Beach FL
What's our future in Iraq? A long and drawn out one. The political pressure to achieve a so-called 'victory' in Iraq is felt on both sides of the political aisle. Its going to take a whole lot of 'shine' for whomever becomes the next president to convince the american people that we've achieved any sort of meaningful and long-term success in this generations' Vietnam.